{"id":9973,"date":"2021-08-08T17:44:32","date_gmt":"2021-08-08T21:44:32","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/alanskeoch.ca\/?p=9973"},"modified":"2021-09-09T07:39:16","modified_gmt":"2021-09-09T11:39:16","slug":"episode-402-make-room-for-heroes-an-interview-with-john-ricker-educator","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/alanskeoch.ca\/?p=9973","title":{"rendered":"EPISODE 402 MAKE ROOM FOR HEROES: AN INTERVIEW WITH JOHN RICKER (EDUCATOR)"},"content":{"rendered":"

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Note..this episode is far too long \u2026SOME DID NOT GET FULL ARTICLE SO I CUT
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MANY ILLUSTRATIONS\u2026HOPE IT WORKS  NOW
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EPISODE 402    MAKE ROOM FOR HEROES: AN INTERVIEW WITH JOHN RICKER <\/p>\n

<\/div>\n
alan skeoch<\/div>\n
august 2021<\/div>\n

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JOHN RICKER\u2026EDUCATOR\u2026A MAN WITH HEROES IN HIS LIFE<\/div>\n

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AT THE END OF THIS EPISODE TRY AND RECORD THE HEROES IN YOUR LIFE<\/div>\n


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In 1986 I wrote a very juvenile article about John Ricker;  Uncovered by pure chance today, August<\/div>\n
5, 2021\u202635 years later.  Who is John Ricker?  In a word I would say he is an educator.  Much more than<\/div>\n
that of course\u2026husband, professor, philosopher, administrator, veteran, father, grandfather, author, Order of Canada, friend.  But he remains<\/div>\n
to me a teacher\u2026my teacher.   Years ago the CBC wanted to interview me on the place of history in<\/div>\n
the Ontario curriculum (or some such thing like that).  A reporter came to Parkdale Collegiate and was<\/div>\n
questioned by our vice principal.  \u201cWhy would you want to see him, he is only a teacher?\u201d  True.  I was<\/div>\n
and always have been \u2018only a teacher\u2019.  Rather proud of the fact.  Early in my career I may have had<\/div>\n
ambitions for higher positions in the educational pyramid.  Maybe later\u2026maybe if I get bored teaching.<\/div>\n
That never happened.  I never wanted to be anything but a teacher.  I owe that to John Ricker.<\/div>\n
He made all of us feel teaching was the noblest of professions when he taught teachers at the<\/div>\n
faculty of eduction way back in 1963.  Made us proud and nervous. Would we measure up?<\/div>\n

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Believe it or not, we still meet monthly at John\u2019s house with a group of friends.  I am 82.  John is 95.<\/div>\n
Very senior ciitizens who gather at our Castlefield Insttute to consider world events and laugh a lot.<\/div>\n
Teachers all …even if one is a judge and another a surgeon.<\/div>\n

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There was no reason for me to find this interview among the dusty files in our cellar.  Pure chance.<\/div>\n
Rather wonderful though.  Not because of what I wrote.  Not my words.  It is the pencilled comments<\/div>\n
that John Ricker scribbled all over the manuscript and then went on and on shedding light on the<\/div>\n
need for all of us to have heroes we admire.<\/div>\n

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\u201cWhat do think of teachers, John?\u201d  What a hopelessly dull question.  I wish I had not asked.  But<\/div>\n
John began to scribble furiously.    The scribbles deciphered.<\/div>\n

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\u201cMost teachers are bright\u2026even though some are terribly dull and stupid.\u201d  Classic Rickerism.<\/div>\n
Seems like a contradiction.  But it is John Ricker taking himself seriously but not that seriously.<\/div>\n
There is room for argument.  \u201cTeachers are bright enough if they are in an atmosphere that<\/div>\n
applies the right kid of pressure and tension on them.\u201d  Internal pressure it seems for the next<\/div>\n
comment was a bit surprising.  \u201cThe problem is that teachers don\u2019t recognize their own heroes.<\/div>\n
For some reason many teachers are afraid to say they have heroes.\u201d<\/div>\n

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\u201cWe fail to ferret out the time-servers and frauds.  But even worse, we don\u2019t make a fuss of<\/div>\n
our heroes.  No room for heroes it seems .  But the heroes are there\u2026masters of their craft<\/div>\n
who continue to grow and change,  When talking about teachers many agree that teachers<\/div>\n
are terrible\u2026except for \u2018so and so\u2019  God, my whole life was changed by old Mr. X. “<\/div>\n

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JAMIE HEMSTEAD JUST LOVeD OUR SCHOOL\u2026JUST LOVED IT\u2026YOU CAN SEE IT IN HIS FACE.<\/div>\n


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\u201cWhy is it that we don\u2019t have monuments to these heroes? You rob a bank and you get a column<\/div>\n
in the newspaper, perhaps even your picture.  But the teacher who changes the way an <\/div>\n
individual functions for the rest of his or her life earns no more than an aside in what  tends<\/div>\n
to be a blanket denunciation of  teaching and teachers.\u201d<\/div>\n

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\u201cThere are teachers who are incompetent. But I don\u2019t think they are a problem because there<\/div>\n
are ways to get them out of schools even though they aren\u2019t used often.  Many think they should be.<\/div>\n
A more serious problem is what to do about the much larger number of marginally competent<\/div>\n
teachers who just go through the motions and have a negative impact on students.\u201d<\/div>\n

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JOHN RICKER\u2019S HEROES<\/div>\n

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\u201cI had two outstanding teachers in elementary school\u2026.Miss Warrander and Mr. Henry.<\/div>\n
Two in secondary school\u2026.Miss McDermid and Mr. Nation<\/div>\n
Three in university\u2026Frank Underhill,  Donald McDougal and Earl Birney.\u201d<\/div>\n

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\u201cBy far, the most outstanding was Miss McDermid at Parkdale Collegiate.  What made her<\/div>\n
outstanding was that she was unquestionably a scholar.  There was no possibility that what<\/div>\n
she taught one year would be the same the next year.  She took delight in her subject and<\/div>\n
was determined that we students would share it .  Tough material did not deter her for a moment.<\/div>\n
She knew what she wanted to achieve and pursued her goal \u2014and us \u2014 relentlessly.  We <\/div>\n
struggled and grumbled but loved her classes.   I think we recognized that this quietly forceful<\/div>\n
woman  was a vitally exciting person and her dedication to learning had made her this way.<\/div>\n
Every lesson revealed her fascination with the creative aspects of life.  Though a Scot, I doubt very<\/div>\n
much that she knew for sure what her salary was.  I think she was probably surprised that<\/div>\n
people paid her to spend her life doing what she loved.  It\u2019s when reflecting on the Miss<\/div>\n
McDermids who have enabled  the profession that I resent most of the teacher charlatans<\/div>\n
who would really rather be doing something else.\u201d<\/div>\n

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John, could you describe this teacher hero in general terms?<\/div>\n

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\u201cSure,the first obligation of  a teacher is to convince his or her students<\/div>\n
that the creative aspects of human experience are exciting.\u201d <\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n


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NOTE:   Respect is basic.  John Ricker did not say this explicitly but the word hero assumes respect .If there is no respect, mutual respect, i.e. student respect for a teacher and the reverse teacher respect<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n<\/div>\n
for his or her students then education does not occur. 









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\u201cTo be so excited by the curriculum that the teacher becomes an exciting person in the school<\/div>\n
whether teaching the chemistry of the DNA molecule or (Voltaire\u2019s Candide).  Money is<\/div>\n
not that important.   Good teachers often do not know what they earn.  They are astounded<\/div>\n
that anyone would pay them to teach.\u201d<\/div>\n

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John maintains we all have our teacher heroes but for some reason keep them hidden.<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n

 Let\u2019s get them out in the open.  <\/p><\/div>\n


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JOHN RICKER\u2019S HEROES:  BIRNEY, UNDERHILL AND MACDOUGAL<\/div>\n

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WHO IS EARL BIRNEY?<\/div>\n

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A spider’s body
limp and hairy
appeared at the bottom of my coffee 
The waiter being Castilian
said passionately nothing
And why indeed should apologies
be made to me 
It was I who was looking in
at the spider
It might be years
before I slipped and drowned
in somebody else’s cup<\/div>\n

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Poet-tree<\/a><\/h1>\n
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i fear that i shall never make
a poem slippier than a snake
or oozing with as fine a juice
as runs in girls or even spruce
no i wont make not now nor later
pnomes as luverlee as pertaters
trees is made by fauns or satyrs
but only taters make pertaters
& trees is grown by sun from sod
& so are the sods who need a god
but poettrees lack any clue
they just need me & maybe you 
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From The Hazel Bough<\/a><\/h1>\n
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I met a lady
on a lazy street
hazel eyes
and little plush feet 
her legs swam by
like lovely trout
eyes were trees
where boys leant out 
hands in the dark and
a river side
round breasts rising
with the finger’s tide 
she was plump as a finch
and live as a salmon
gay as silk and
proud as a Brahmin 
we winked when we met
and laughed when we parted
never took time
to be brokenhearted 
but no man sees
where the trout lie now
or what leans out
from the hazel bough<\/div>\n

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The Bear On The Delhi Road<\/a><\/h1>\n
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Unreal tall as a myth
by the road the Himalayan bear
is beating the brilliant air
with his crooked arms
About him two men bare
spindly as locusts leap 
One pulls on a ring
in the great soft nose His mate
flicks flicks with a stick
up at the rolling eyes 
They have not led him here
down from the fabulous hills
to this bald alien plain
and the clamorous world to kill
but simply to teach him to dance 
They are peaceful both these spare
men of Kashmir and the bear
alive is their living too
If far on the Delhi way
around him galvanic they dance
it is merely to wear wear
from his shaggy body the tranced
wish forever to stay
only an ambling bear
four-footed in berries 
It is no more joyous for them
in this hot dust to prance
out of reach of the praying claws
sharpened to paw for ants
in the shadows ofdeodars
It is not easy to free
myth from reality
or rear this fellow up
to lurch lurch with them
in the tranced dancing of men<\/div>\n

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WHO WAS FRANK UNDERHILL?<\/div>\n
\"Frank<\/div>\n
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A nation is a body of people who have done great things together in the past and hope to do great things together in the future.<\/span><\/a>

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Frank Underhill<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n

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Frank Underhill (1889-1971) practically invented the role of public intellectual in English Canada through his journalism, essays, teaching, and political activity. He became one of the country’s most controversial figures in the middle of the twentieth century by confronting the central political issues of his time and by actively working to reform the Canadian political landscape. His propagation of socialist ideas during the Great Depression and his criticism of the British Empire and British foreign policy almost cost him his job at the University of Toronto. In Frank Underhill and the Politics of Ideas, Kenneth Dewar demonstrates how Underhill’s thought evolved from his days as a student at Toronto and Oxford, to his drafting of the Regina Manifesto – the founding platform of the leftist Co-operative Commonwealth Federation – to his support of his long-time friend Lester Pearson\u2019s Liberals in the 1960s. Not willing to be bound by partisan loyalties, his later shift toward the political centre dismayed many of his former allies. The various issues Underhill confronted, Dewar argues, were connected by the pioneering role he played as an intellectual and by his social democratic vision of politics. Dewar also reassesses Underhill\u2019s historical work, focusing on how it differed from the new professional history practised by his younger colleagues. Intelligently written and thoroughly researched, Frank Underhill and the Politics of Ideas delivers important insights into twentieth-century political life and innumerable lessons for twenty-first century Canada. <\/div>\n
JUST MY THOUGHTS\u2026BASED ON VERY LITTLE RESEARCH<\/div>\n
For some Bizarre reason the word \u2018socialism\u2019 angers many Americans.  Perhaps because they associate socialists too closely with Stalinism<\/div>\n
and the excesses of Soviet communism.   Half a century ago Isaac Deutscher said that political change can only come from the turbulence of<\/div>\n
free thought in the United States.  I remember that.  Even if it seem unlikely today.<\/div>\n
To listen to Trumpists the word socialism is akin to the ideas that are found in the  depths of evil.  Underfhill was a socialist<\/div>\n
who became a Liberal.  For that he paid a price.  Seems to me that John Ricker took the same<\/div>\n
path only did not have to pay the price of alienation.  John Ricker gets a thrill out of the freedom<\/div>\n
of thought\u2026does so with humour and joy\u2026fears not the turmoil of ideas.  Revels in them as Underhilll<\/div>\n
must have done.<\/div>\n<\/div>\n
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WHY DO SOME PEOPLE CONSIDER SOCIALISM FRIGHTENING?  <\/span><\/font><\/div>\n

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Socialists choose cooperation to competition, and favour collectivism over individualism. The defining, value of socialism is equality, socialism sometimes being portrayed as a form of egalitarianism. Socialists consider that a measure of social equality is the essential assurance of social stability and cohesion, and that it supports freedom in the sense that it gratifies material needs and helps for personal development. The socialist movement has conventionally articulated the interests of the industrial working class, seen as systematically troubled or structurally disadvantaged within the capitalist system. The objective of socialism is to lessen or abolish class divisions.<\/span><\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n

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WHO ARE MY HEROES?<\/div>\n

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\u201cAlan, I thought this Episode was about John Ricker not Alan Skeoch.\u201d  :<\/div>\n
“Good point Marjorie\u201d<\/div>\n
\u201cThen why continue?\u201d<\/div>\n
\u201cBecause I would just like to give my heroes a good airing.\u201d<\/div>\n
\u201cBoring, Alan\u2026drifting into boredom\u201d<\/div>\n
\u201cYou might be right we seem to be living in an anti-heroic time where humans that were<\/div>\n
once leaders have their statues desecrated with paint and their figures decapitated.\u201d<\/div>\n
\u201cYou know something, Alan, you might have hit on something. We all have heroes <\/div>\n
but rarely say so.\u201d<\/div>\n
\u201cThat is the point John Ricker made.\u201d<\/div>\n
\u201cJust who are your heroes?\u201d<\/div>\n

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(If you do not want to read about my heroes then start listing your own herroes>)<\/div>\n

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I am such a shallow person \u2026no great depth of political insight like Ricker.  A child of the<\/div>\n
1950\u2019s.  Part of a generation of undeserved wealth earned by the fires of the Great Depression<\/div>\n
and the sacrifices of so many lives in a war soon to be a footnote.<\/div>\n

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I have a lot of heroes.<\/div>\n

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In elementary school there were two.  Miss Sharpely who loved us  and Mr. Hambly who<\/div>\n
made earth science come alive.  He hung a huge wasps nest in his room to which some fired<\/div>\n
paper clips from elastic bands.  But meant no disrespect.<\/div>\n

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In secondary school there were more<\/div>\n
Evan Cruickshank<\/div>\n
Roberta Charlesworth<\/div>\n
Maida Schroeder<\/div>\n
Duncan Green<\/div>\n
Fred Burford<\/div>\n
Wally Little<\/div>\n

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In the university of Toronto there were heroes of a different sort<\/div>\n
Marcus Long , philosopher…<\/div>\n
Marjorie Hughes, open arms, open heart\u2026made me a lucky man<\/div>\n
Dr. Norman Paterson, geophysicist who made science exciting <\/div>\n

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Voltaire, Steinbeck, Michener, Kant, Rousseau and a host of others not least of<\/div>\n
which was Eric Fromm\u2019s book  The Sane Society.  Somewhere in the book<\/div>\n
Fromm argued that everyone should get the same wage. Then people would<\/div>\n
choose careers they love rather than careers that paid the most money.  And we <\/div>\n
would be a happier people.<\/div>\n
When I said that to my friends they thought I was nuts.<\/div>\n

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and later in post grad<\/div>\n

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John Ricker<\/div>\n
Andrew Lockhart<\/div>\n
Desmond Morton<\/div>\n
Phyllis Morgon<\/div>\n

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If I had to choose one high school mega hero, it would be Evan Cruickshank.  Although<\/div>\n
I never noticed it at the time \u201cCrooky\u201d taught me to think for myself<\/div>\n
with three little words  \u201cI don\u2019t know,\u201d  I was not a person that devoted <\/div>\n
myself to homework.  Skipped doing it whenever I could which was<\/div>\n
often.  I meant no disrespect to my teachers.  There just was not enough<\/div>\n
time to do everything\u2026sports, dancing, dating girls, reading for pleasure, earning<\/div>\n
a little money.  So I skipped homework and accepted the odd detention<\/div>\n
for doing so.  One detention was memorable.  Roberta Charlesworth<\/div>\n
kept me after school to serve a detention in her room.  Seemed easier<\/div>\n
to serve it in the girls gym where there were females in bloomers to look<\/div>\n
at.  Roberta Charlesworth was the girls coach.  Next day she called me<\/div>\n
to the front of the class\u2026I always tried to find a middle seat\u2026why did<\/div>\n
she want me?  She promptly lifted me off the ground by my ear.  \u201cWhen<\/div>\n
you serve a detention with me you do it here in this room not in the girls gym.<\/div>\n
I respected her as a teacher\u2026.one of my teacher heroes in spite of my<\/div>\n
sore ear..<\/div>\n

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But \u201cCrooky\u201d takes  the prize with his simple \u201cI don\u2019t know\u201d<\/div>\n
technique.  I respected him.  Stood in awe of him at times.  His explanation<\/div>\n
of Marxian socialism stays with me to this day.  <\/div>\n

<\/div>\n
One day however I got up my nerve to ask him about some event<\/div>\n
in history that intrigued me.  Crooky would surely know.  Bt he did not.<\/div>\n
He even confessed \u201cI don\u2019t know\u201d which sent me scurrying to the library<\/div>\n
that evening just to help Crooky out.   Not to suck around. I did that<\/div>\n
out of respect.   Later I discovered that his \u2018I don\u2019t know\u2019 may have<\/div>\n
been deliberate but I was never sure.  \u201cCrooky\u201d asked big time questions.<\/div>\n
But he was also humble\u2026open minded.<\/div>\n

<\/div>\n
John Ricker became a hero as well.  He conveyed a deep love for<\/div>\n
big questions.  The kind that start simply but lead to universal truths.<\/div>\n
I was very sorry when I heard that John had become Dean of<\/div>\n
the Faculty of Educaton.  That meant he would no longer be facing<\/div>\n
down classes of new teachers.  Teaching.  I even told him so John could make us think<\/div>\n
about history from many angles.  Made us realize we were taking on<\/div>\n
a sacred trust by shaping young people.  He had respect.  Without<\/div>\n
respect , as I mentioned, no solid teacher-student learning can occur.<\/div>\n
One of his methods was similar to Crooky but different also.  When a <\/div>\n
student asked John a question there was often a pause\u2026a dead silence <\/div>\n
in the room while John considered his answer.  In 1963 the silence was aided<\/div>\n
and abetted by drawing on a cigarette and then reaching for his coffee cup.<\/div>\n
Dead and total silence when he did that.   W were like the Israelites waiting<\/div>\n
for Moses to bring word from on high.  And John consumed books like a<\/div>\n
bull does ensilage with one different. The ideas in a good book went to<\/div>\n
his brain and not his stomach.<\/div>\n

<\/div>\n
Life takes curious twists and turns.  Most surprising of these twists and<\/div>\n
turns is that both  Evan Cruickshank and John Ricker became good<\/div>\n
friends.   Peers in the pursuit of knowledge.  Shapers of the minds<\/div>\n
of students.  Both of them pushed me towards Parkdale Collegiate.<\/div>\n
\u201cIf you teach at that school, you will never want to leave, Alan.\u201d<\/div>\n
So true.<\/div>\n

<\/div>\n
NOW FOR THE CHALLENGE<\/div>\n

<\/div>\n
Who are your heroes?<\/div>\n




REMEMBER THE SODER IN THE COFFEE CUP?<\/div>\n
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WHO IS EARL BIRNEY?<\/div>\n

<\/div>\n
\n
A spider’s body
limp and hairy
appeared at the bottom of my coffee 
The waiter being Castilian
said passionately nothing
And why indeed should apologies
be made to me 
It was I who was looking in
at the spider
It might be years
before I slipped and drowned
in somebody else’s cup<\/div>\n

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WHAT IS THE BEST SCHOOL?  EASY TO ANSWER\u2026THE BEST SCHOOL IS THE SCHOOL YOU ARE TEACHING IN TODAY\u2026MAKE<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/blockquote>\n

IT THAT WAY.  NOT YESTERDAY\u2019S SCHOOL OR TOMORROW\u2019S SCHOOL.  THE SCHOOL YOU ARE TEACHING IN TODAY IS<\/p><\/div>\n

BEST AND YOU HAVE A DUTY TO MAKE IT SO.
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A LOT OF MY HEROES AT THE UIVERSITY OFTORONTO WERE ON OUR FOOTBALL TEAM\u2026.ABOVE<\/div>\n

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PRINCIPAL SHIELA HAMBLETON WAS A VERY KIND AND SHARING HERO\u2026LED BY EXAMPLE<\/div>\n

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HEROES IN MY LIFE CAME IN ALL KINDS OF SHAPES AND FORMS\u2026TEACHERS AND STUDENTS. <\/div>\n

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Note..this episode is far too long \u2026SOME DID NOT GET FULL ARTICLE SO I CUT MANY ILLUSTRATIONS\u2026HOPE IT WORKS  NOW EPISODE 402    MAKE ROOM FOR HEROES: AN INTERVIEW WITH JOHN RICKER  alan skeoch august 2021 JOHN RICKER\u2026EDUCATOR\u2026A MAN WITH HEROES IN HIS LIFE AT THE END OF THIS EPISODE TRY AND RECORD THE HEROES […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":1,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[1],"tags":[],"class_list":["post-9973","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-uncategorized"],"_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/alanskeoch.ca\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/9973","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/alanskeoch.ca\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/alanskeoch.ca\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/alanskeoch.ca\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/users\/1"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/alanskeoch.ca\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcomments&post=9973"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/alanskeoch.ca\/index.php?rest_route=\/wp\/v2\/posts\/9973\/revisions"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/alanskeoch.ca\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fmedia&parent=9973"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/alanskeoch.ca\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Fcategories&post=9973"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/alanskeoch.ca\/index.php?rest_route=%2Fwp%2Fv2%2Ftags&post=9973"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}